The Spectator Podcast: Macron vs Salvini

This week antagonism between Emmanuel Macron and Italy’s Matteo Salvini ratcheted up over immigration – are they the leaders of an ideological battle in Europe? But pro-immigration or not, both Macron and Salvini smashed through conventional politics in the global surge of populism. As we reach the tenth anniversary of the 2008 crash, we ask, did the financial crisis lead to greater populism? And last, why have Americans been boycotting Nike?

First, is there a battle brewing in Europe over immigration? On the one side, Emmanuel Macron seems to represent the ideals of a globalist EU, the natural successor to Merkel’s liberalism; on the other, Italy’s Matteo Salvini is bringing anti-immigrant populism into the very heart of the EU, supported by movements across the continent and fellow leaders like Hungary’s Viktor Orban. Christopher Caldwell argues in this week’s cover piece that this is an ideological battle for Europe’s future. He joins Isabel on the podcast, together with Sophie Pedder, the Economist’s Paris Bureau Chief and author of ‘Revolution Française’, a new biography on Macron.